Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

The day to day working of the Caledonian Railway Company, including its constituents and successors.
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WCML55.68
Posts: 322
Joined: Sat May 31, 2014 5:37 pm

Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by WCML55.68 »

Evening,

Just stumbled across this lovely shot on Flickr, dunno if its a known photo but hopefully of interest.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/joesonoft ... ateposted/

Paul.
caleyJim
Posts: 267
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:10 pm

Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by caleyJim »

A very interesting photograph. I especially love the 'Monte Carlo' poster on the wall. At that date, I doubt many Glaswegians would have the vaguest idea of where that was!

Jim :D
David Blevins
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Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by David Blevins »

I have identified the Station Master as Andrew Pelling from our Caledonian Railway Staff List.
He was appointed to to Dalmuir Station in 1903, replacing William Russell.
Recorded as staying in the Station House in 1905.
His last residence recorded was 651, Dumbarton Road, Dalmuir in 1915, which was only about 10 minutes walk away from the Station.
A pity we cannot identify the other Caledonian Railway Staff in the photograph but they too could have been living fairly close by.

David Blevins.
Attachments
Dalmuir Station 1909 - Copy.jpg
Dalmuir Station 1909 - Copy.jpg (76.65 KiB) Viewed 4491 times
Jim Summers
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Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by Jim Summers »

The deterioration in the tiles and the crude posting of the bills are what strike me.

JimS
JimG
Posts: 300
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 12:15 am

Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by JimG »

Jim Summers wrote: Mon Mar 13, 2023 12:45 pm The deterioration in the tiles and the crude posting of the bills are what strike me.
I noticed the tiles as well. I thought that glazed tiles and bricks were the norm on the L&D. I remember that the tiles on Dumbarton East and Dumbarton Central still seemed to be in reasonable condition when I knew the stations in the 1950s/60s/70s.

Jim G.
WCML55.68
Posts: 322
Joined: Sat May 31, 2014 5:37 pm

Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by WCML55.68 »

caleyJim wrote: Mon Mar 13, 2023 9:16 am A very interesting photograph. I especially love the 'Monte Carlo' poster on the wall. At that date, I doubt many Glaswegians would have the vaguest idea of where that was!

Jim :D
Or have the wages! I would think the Clyde Coast would be the norm, maybe a bit of CR publicity.
Jim Summers wrote: Mon Mar 13, 2023 12:45 pm The deterioration in the tiles and the crude posting of the bills are what strike me.

JimS
I thought they were glazed tiles and would be extremely resilient. Probably damaged through removal of old posters or weather damage, perhaps they were a batch of really poor quality.
I wonder if it is possible for the society to obtain a higher resolution copy from Joe, Flickr, I'm sure those posters would yield a wealth of information.

Through the open door appears to be a glazed/cast iron Fireplace with a mirror mounted above which reflects the open door on the left but I canny think what the rest of it is.
David Blevins wrote: Mon Mar 13, 2023 11:04 am I have identified the Station Master as Andrew Pelling from our Caledonian Railway Staff List.
He was appointed to to Dalmuir Station in 1903, replacing William Russell.
Recorded as staying in the Station House in 1905.
His last residence recorded was 651, Dumbarton Road, Dalmuir in 1915, which was only about 10 minutes walk away from the Station.
A pity we cannot identify the other Caledonian Railway Staff in the photograph but they too could have been living fairly close by.

David Blevins.
Thats just incredible to be able to identify even one person in the photo, David. Its 114 years old. I wonder if the family is still going, might be a source of other material.
Is it possible to identify all the uniforms and why are there two suits?

One other thing Ive noticed is the incredible likeness of the lad third from the left, pinstripe suit and bunnet, to the Glasgow-born actor Mark Cox who plays Tam Mullen in Still Game. I wonder? The photo on Flickr using the link above is very much clearer.

Paul.
WCML55.68
Posts: 322
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Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by WCML55.68 »

Re the mirror reflection, might have answered my own question. Looks like it might be the footbridge railings with a telegraph pole and notice beside.

https://www.railscot.co.uk/img/82/125/
Dave John
Posts: 230
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 8:42 am

Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by Dave John »

A very interesting picture. As mentioned I am surprised that the surface of so many tiles have spalled, it would be a relatively new building in 1909.
John Paton
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Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2012 4:50 pm

Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by John Paton »

I am also surprised that the tiling has deteriorated so quickly - and that the staff put posters directly onto the tiled wall. Virtually every other CR station photo I have seen has a vast variety of posterboards - usually with headers denoting CR, other railway companies or shipping lines; onto which all advertising was posted.
Adverts for Monte Carlo are seen in other photos, and foreign travel was advertised in the CR Tourist Guides. I attach two photos, and extracts from the CR Tourist Guide of May + June 1013.
John
Attachments
Pages fromCaledonian Railway Tourist Guide May + June 1913.jpg
Pages fromCaledonian Railway Tourist Guide May + June 1913.jpg (106.69 KiB) Viewed 4403 times
Peebles - cropped photo.jpg
Peebles - cropped photo.jpg (31.06 KiB) Viewed 4403 times
Jamaica St 1914.jpg
Jamaica St 1914.jpg (144.88 KiB) Viewed 4403 times
John Paton
Posts: 309
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Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by John Paton »

The September 1964 photo appears to show the damaged tiling replaced, possibly by a smooth cement render finish. Also framing added to the pillars. The post-closure photo shows the wall of the bay window also clad in a smooth material, and the same framing on the next pillar.

John
Attachments
Dalmuir Rside after closure.JPG
Dalmuir Rside after closure.JPG (99.73 KiB) Viewed 4357 times
Dalmuir Riverside Sept 1964.jpg
Dalmuir Riverside Sept 1964.jpg (61.9 KiB) Viewed 4357 times
John Paton
Posts: 309
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Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by John Paton »

The same treatment was applied at Clydebank Riverside as shown in this photo. Maybe the tiles there were faulty.

John
Attachments
Cbank Rside P1050081.JPG
Cbank Rside P1050081.JPG (87.27 KiB) Viewed 4356 times
caleyJim
Posts: 267
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:10 pm

Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by caleyJim »

John Paton wrote: Tue Mar 14, 2023 1:47 pm Adverts for Monte Carlo are seen in other photos, and foreign travel was advertised in the CR Tourist Guides. I attach two photos, and extracts from the CR Tourist Guide of May + June 1013.
John
I'm glad I mentioned Monte Carlo if only for the cracking photo of Jamaica Street John supplied. A delightful period study in stark contrast to the soleless hotel which now stands on the site (which I regularly pass on my way to and from work on the other side of the river.)

Jim :D
Jim Summers
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Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by Jim Summers »

And of the water tank above the original Glasgow Central!
A wonderful picture.

JimS
JimG
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Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by JimG »

John Paton wrote: Wed Mar 15, 2023 11:42 am The same treatment was applied at Clydebank Riverside as shown in this photo. Maybe the tiles there were faulty.
Considering that the building had only been built in the mid-1890s it certainly hadn't taken long for the faults to develop. Considering the experience builders had with tiling with all the wally closes and suchlike on Clydeside, it might have been exterior climatic conditions which caused it. My father was born and brought up in Dalmuir near the beginning of the last century and I can't remember him remarking on extreme climates in his childhood. :D

Jim G.
David Blevins
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Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by David Blevins »

I am offering a suggestion to the Damaged Glazed Tiles at Dalmuir Station.
Dominating the South side of the Railway Line was Beardmores Ship Yard, part of the Smithy, Blacksmiths, Platers Shed, etc., can be seen in the original Photo.
The enclosed Plan and Photographs will give an idea of how Large this Beardmores Yard was, and employed approximately 5000 people.
The Photo is taken about 1905, nearing completion of the ShipYard, showing the Gas Producers (1500 feet from the Station) and the Power Station Building behind, and beyond the Water Tank is where the Beardmore Street entrance is, 500 feet from the Station Building.
Coal was converted into Gas which in turn, was used for Gas engines/Turbines to produce Electricity.
Besides the Gas Producers is a Building "Sulphate House" producing Sulphuric Acid, now this is quite a combination of Dangerous Chemicals which must have pervaded the Air around the Yard, no wonder one doe's not seen any grass or growing plants in these places. I well remember doing a Tour of a Lanarkshire Steelworks as a teenager, just started their as a Clerk, and Greenery was definitely not to be seen.
The Westerly winds of Scotland driving up the River Clyde must have carried the Gas/Acid/Smoke onto Dalmuir Station on a Daily basis, do we have an explanation for the deteriation on the Glazed Tiles, and the later Harling applied to the walls for future protection.
Nowadays we talk about "Acid Rain" but back in the 1900's it was an every day occurence in the Industrial Age, of which we new very little - we just got on with it!
No wonder our Forefathers didn't Live to an Old Age back then.

David Blevins.
Attachments
Beardmore Shipyard Dalmuir 1905 - Copy - Copy 1.jpg
Beardmore Shipyard Dalmuir 1905 - Copy - Copy 1.jpg (111.23 KiB) Viewed 4261 times
Beardmore Shipyard 1906 Dalmuir_0002.jpg
Beardmore Shipyard 1906 Dalmuir_0002.jpg (98.47 KiB) Viewed 4267 times
Beardmore Shipyard 1906 Dalmuir - Copy.jpg
Beardmore Shipyard 1906 Dalmuir - Copy.jpg (104.42 KiB) Viewed 4289 times
Beardmore Shipyard 1906 Dalmuir_0001.jpg
Beardmore Shipyard 1906 Dalmuir_0001.jpg (69.75 KiB) Viewed 4289 times
WCML55.68
Posts: 322
Joined: Sat May 31, 2014 5:37 pm

Re: Dalmuir Riverside photo 1909

Post by WCML55.68 »

Been studying the original Flickr photo again which is much clearer. Click on the photo to enlarge and click again to enlarge further.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/joesonoft ... 55-2oiGQdA

Most of the damage to the tiles are at the edges or corners which certainly suggest external force but close examination shows that the damage to the ones to the right along with the higher ones appears much darker, almost black. The damage stops completely above door height, either out of reach or sheltered by the canopy. Theres two upright raised portions on the tiles plus a narrower section to the right which I think are too narrow for posters so probably poster removal is not the answer. In my years in Glasgow I vividly remember the peasoupers when one couldnt see across the road but snow, only once and literally a smattering but dont remember any ice at all. The acid rain theory is interesting.

Re the mirror, closer Flickr examination does shows the footbridge steps to the right so the upright must be a lattice side.

And lastly two photos to compare, when I first saw the photo I immediately thought Thats Tam.. its the characteristic eyes but the family likeness is uncanny and I do wonder if its a relation of Mark Cox 3 or 4 generations earlier.
Attachments
DALMUIR RIVERSIDE 1909 DETAIL.jpg
DALMUIR RIVERSIDE 1909 DETAIL.jpg (59.23 KiB) Viewed 4234 times
MARK COX aka TAM MULLEN (2).jpg
MARK COX aka TAM MULLEN (2).jpg (52.75 KiB) Viewed 4234 times
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