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Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2023 9:58 pm
by Graham R
I have been adding a small collection of colour slides of Mid Lanark locations to the CRA photo archive, most likely taken by Fred Landery and passed to Donald Peddie who sadly died before he was able to accession them. (Thumbnails are available on the FSLS website, images CRA84456 to CRA84532: if you are a CRA member who does not already have a login and would like access, contact Sinclair our genial Treasurer and Webmaster at webmaster@crassoc.org.uk).

The slides came without any identification apart from serial numbers, and are either copies or have been remounted. It is possible they were copied for use in videos since some appear in Douglas Miller's excellent 1997 film "Rails to Coalburn" available on Youtube here. A few of the locations have stumped me, so I am hoping to crowdsource, or at least CRAsource, the correct answers.

Here's the first series. All the locations feature LMSR 42737, Class 5MT ("Crab" 2-6-0) on a railtour, which with the help of the invaluable website sixbellsjunction.co.uk can be identified as the SLS (Scottish Area)'s "Scottish Rambler No 3" tour on 29 March 1964.

42737 worked the 6-coach train on the route Glasgow Central - Eglinton Street - Rutherglen Jn - Newton - Uddingston - Motherwell - Ross Jn - Ferniegair Jn - Merryton Jn - Larkhall East - Dalserf - Swinehill -) Dalserf - Larkhall East - Ferniegair Jn - Ross Jn - Motherwell - Shieldmuir Jn - Law Jn - Lanark Jn - Carstairs - Dolphinton Jn - Auchengray - Wilsontown South Jn - Wilsontown North Jn - Wilsontown West Jn - Haywood - Wilsontown - Haywood - Wilsontown West Jn - Wilsontown South Jn - Auchengray - Dolphinton Jn - Strawfrank Jn - Symington (2) - Biggar - Broughton - Biggar - Symington - Beattock Summit - Beattock before handing over to 80118 for a trip to Moffat, then finally 42737 returned Beattock - Beattock Summit - Symington - Carstairs - Lanark Jn - Law Jn - Shieldmuir Jn - Motherwell - Uddingston - Newton - Rutherglen Jn - Eglinton Street - Glasgow Central High Level. So not strictly all mid-Lanark lines!

Image 1
20230309-032(1).jpg
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Image 2 (same location I think)
20230309-045(1).jpg
20230309-045(1).jpg (53.47 KiB) Viewed 3451 times
Image 3. Note the Glasgow Corporation buses in a garage beyond the overbridge.
20230309-033(1).jpg
20230309-033(1).jpg (44.57 KiB) Viewed 3451 times
Image 4
20230309-053(1).jpg
20230309-053(1).jpg (41.74 KiB) Viewed 3451 times
Image 5
20230309-055(1).jpg
20230309-055(1).jpg (54.75 KiB) Viewed 3451 times
Any ideas where they might be?

Graham Roberts (Photo Archivist)

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2023 7:14 am
by dunalastairv
I think you will find image 5 is Dalserf. This station appeared in another query originated by Jim Summers in the 'private section' of the Forum and the building matches.

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2023 8:56 am
by Graham R
Thanks Michael - it's obvious once someone points it out! I don't know why it didn't click. Any idea about the others?
Graham

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2023 9:54 pm
by caleyJim
I can't identify any of the locations but I'd question if those are Glasgow Corporation buses in Image 3. The leftmost one looks more red and white/cream to me while the other two look green. Unfortunately the image as posted does not enlarge well.

Jim :D

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2023 11:01 pm
by jimwatt2mm
caleyJim wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 9:54 pm I can't identify any of the locations but I'd question if those are Glasgow Corporation buses in Image 3. The leftmost one looks more red and white/cream to me while the other two look green. Unfortunately the image as posted does not enlarge well.

Jim :D
I'd agree that they are not Glasgow Corporation, but I think the one on the left (nearest the road) is actually green and cream. The red is adverts on the side and front, the latter to the nearside of the destination blind. Eastern Scottish buses were both green overall and green and cream.

Jim W

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2023 8:06 am
by jasp
The part of the bus visible between the two poles is definitely in GCT green and orange.
Jim P

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2023 10:54 am
by jimwatt2mm
jasp wrote: Thu Apr 06, 2023 8:06 am The part of the bus visible between the two poles is definitely in GCT green and orange.
Jim P
So it is! I hadn't noticed the orange just visible above the fence. :?

Jim W

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2023 1:23 pm
by caleyJim
Given the variety of colours, might I suggest it to be a bus-breaker rather than a garage? Don't know if that helps any...

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Sat Apr 08, 2023 12:57 pm
by wsaxt04
Hi everyone,

Sources of information on the Lanarkshire Lines :

‘TTL’, no.90, Oct.’05, a series by Fred Landery surveyed these lines. Would be worthwhile searching through the various subsequent articles, along with their photographs, and try to identify the locations.

‘Railscot’ web-site : as per above, search on this web-site for the various well-known stations and locations, such as Stonehouse, Fernigair, blackwood, and so on.

‘TTL’ no.137, July ’17, did provide info on a mini bus outing we made way back in April of that year, but the photographs probably be of limited use for your own project.

Good hunting !!
Arnold T.

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2023 2:58 pm
by Graham R
Thanks to those who commented so far. I was on the 2017 minibus tour Arnold mentions, but most of the locations have changed so extensively that it is very hard to reconcile them with pictures from fifty years ago. An exception is Tillietudlem platform shelter which I recognised from our tour. although the site is now overgrown by woodland.

Here's an enlargement of that bus garage seen through the overbridge, in case that awakens memories.
20230309-033-detail.jpg
20230309-033-detail.jpg (89.37 KiB) Viewed 3239 times
Another shot I have struggled to place is this one of 45157 with a Class E train of mineral wagons entering sidings from a double-track railway. It might be in the Blantyre - Hamilton vicinity. Does anyone recognise the location?
20230309-086(1).jpg
20230309-086(1).jpg (43.89 KiB) Viewed 3239 times
Here is a viaduct numbered "7" which might be near Larkhall. Any takers?
20230309-078(1).jpg
20230309-078(1).jpg (44.88 KiB) Viewed 3239 times
And another shorter viaduct, again likely to be in the mid Lanark area:
20230309-038(1).jpg
20230309-038(1).jpg (69.42 KiB) Viewed 3239 times
:

regards
Graham

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2023 8:56 pm
by jimwatt2mm
Graham R wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 2:58 pm
Here's an enlargement of that bus garage seen through the overbridge, in case that awakens memories.

20230309-033-detail.jpg
I see from that that all three buses are indeed Glasgow Corporation.

Jim W

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Tue Apr 11, 2023 4:58 pm
by John Paton
Hi Graham,

Viaduct 7 might be Larkhall viaduct. Here is my photo taken after track lifting.
20230309-032 and 20230309-045 are Larkhall East
20230309-055 is Dalserf
I'm afraid that I draw a blank with the others.

John

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Tue Apr 11, 2023 5:12 pm
by John Paton
Thinking further on 20230309-033, the line south of Larkhall East didn't pass through many settlements, and following its route on the 1962-64 1:2500 OS sheets on the NLS website, the only location similar to that photo is just south of Birkenshaw. The town of Larkhall would be in the background.

John

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Tue Apr 11, 2023 5:36 pm
by John Paton
After some real headbanging I finally managed to look through Fred's photos on the FSLS website. I see that Alton Heights Junction (a wooden box that had a brick base inserted by the LMS) is on two occasions mis-identified as Blackwood Junction, which had a tall all-brick box. I can identify a few other locations but unfortunately it doesn't seem possible to 'copy and paste' the file name, which makes identifying the slide I am referring to difficult.

John

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Tue Apr 11, 2023 6:21 pm
by jimwatt2mm
John Paton wrote: Tue Apr 11, 2023 4:58 pm Viaduct 7 might be Larkhall viaduct. Here is my photo taken after track lifting.
Is it not more likely to be the one nearer Stonehouse, taken from the Larkhall end? There appears to be a slight curve to it whereas the Larkhall one is dead straight.

Jim W

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Tue Apr 11, 2023 9:47 pm
by John Paton
Hi Jim,

Stonehouse viaduct was much more curved than that in the photo posted by Graham - see my photo below. My photo also shows that Stonehouse viaduct was number '2' (see wall on left). I also think that the background is different.

John

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Tue Apr 11, 2023 10:45 pm
by jimwatt2mm
Point taken, John. So, were the bridges numbered from the Stonehouse end?

Jim W

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Wed Apr 12, 2023 4:57 pm
by John Paton
I guess so, Jim.

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Wed Apr 12, 2023 10:30 pm
by Graham R
John, thank you for catching the error regarding Blackwood Junction and images CRA84462 and CRA84532. (The best way to identify an FSLS image is using the "FSLS Entry" identifier at top right of the browser - the filename is not necessarily unique in the CRA archive, especially for locomotive images, but the FSLS Entry identifier is).

I have updated the descriptions and locations.

regards
Graham

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Wed Apr 12, 2023 10:51 pm
by caleyJim
jimwatt2mm wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 8:56 pm
Graham R wrote: Mon Apr 10, 2023 2:58 pm
Here's an enlargement of that bus garage seen through the overbridge, in case that awakens memories.

20230309-033-detail.jpg
I see from that that all three buses are indeed Glasgow Corporation.

Jim W
I too concur. Amazing what a few more pixels can do !

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2023 12:56 pm
by Orraman
Enlarged bus picture

Could someone clarify the gold lettering to the right of the picture?

Currently in France using a portable so cannot get a clear image but it appears to read The Kings Arms?

Might that help establish the location?

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2023 1:43 pm
by jimwatt2mm
Orraman wrote: Thu Apr 13, 2023 12:56 pm
Could someone clarify the gold lettering to the right of the picture?

Currently in France using a portable so cannot get a clear image but it appears to read The Kings Arms?

Might that help establish the location?
I can't make out the lettering at the LH end of the building, but the larger lettering seems to start 'JACK'S....'.

Jim W

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Sun Apr 16, 2023 4:58 pm
by DFORSYTH
Image 1 Larkhall East
Image 2 Larkhall East
Image 5 Dalserf

Similar images are on the Railscot Web site

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Sun Apr 16, 2023 5:46 pm
by DFORSYTH
Image 3

This photograph is deceiving as there is a ‘red herring’ to deceive us, or should I say a ‘cream, green, yellow and orange herring’, namely the Glasgow Corporation Transport buses.

The ones where we can see the fronts have, from top to bottom: green on the roof and all around the upper deck including the window frames; then there is a cream dividing strip; the lower section is painted yellow including the window frames. These two buses are possibly Metro-Cammel-bodied Regent IIIs. This paint scheme was effective from September 1959 until the formation of the Greater Glasgow PTE in 1973.

The one at the back has: cream on the roof and around the upper window frames; underneath there is a band of green; the lower deck is painted cream around the window frames but below that everything else is painted orange. From 1948 bus roofs were painted cream, reverting to the livery adapted in 1939. Between 1940 and 1947 bus roofs had been painted green so that they would be less visible from above during night-time air raids.

This information has been obtained from Fawndoon Books, Title: Glasgow Buses, Author: Stuart Brown

On first impressions looking at this photo, we would therefore assume that we are looking at a bus ‘turn-around’ point at the end of a Glasgow bus route. Possibly on a post war estate built on the outskirts of the City. There looks like what could be a pub with large letters signage on the front (part seen) under the bridge. It was common to also build a pub also on new estates being built to serve the ‘new incomers’

However, we would be wrong. this is NOT A GLASGOW LOCATION. It is nowhere near the City.

Re: Mid Lanark Lines in the 1960s

Posted: Sun Apr 16, 2023 6:21 pm
by DFORSYTH
Image 3 continued

You may be interested to see this photo of the train being slowly moved onto the bridge so that it can be photographed from the road below.
It was taken by John Robin on 29 March 1964.

Note how foolhardy the chap was standing on the bridge parapet. One slip and he would have been over the edge.

Off to have a cup of tea now - will tell you were the location is in my next posting.